holding electric yellow

[Dave Schulman]

I have a 2inch electric yellow lab. and it has babies in her mouth. Shes in a 5 gallon (away from her buddies) and the only tank mate shes got is a little cory cat. Last time she was holding she ate them but she was in my big tank then. Anyone know if she will let them out naturally or if i should strip her? If so how do u do that and should i take her out if she does it naturally???
Thanx
"ThE AnGrYfIsH"

[fOx]

The following came from the Greater Chicago Cichlid Association....

Most mouthbrooding cichlid females will hold fry for 14 to 28 days. During this time, they may become ematiated because they don't eat while holding fry. There are several reasons to strip mouthbrooding cichlids:

1. To increase the brood size since the female may eat some portion of the spawn if you allow her to go to term.
2. To prevent females from eating/spitting out or losing the spawn prematurely.
3. To extend the life of the female and her productivity so she can have more broods in a shorter period of time. In an active tank, some stubborn females will continue to hold fry until they expire rather than release fry.

How to strip a female:

1. Get a clean bucket or large plastic container, a turkey baster, a clean toothpick and a net. Have a tank ready for the fry.
2. Siphon some water into the bucket. About 4 inches or so.
3. Net out the fish.
4. Wet your hand and hold the fish in your left hand if you are right handed.
5. Gently use the toothpick to pry open the female's mouth and keep it open. Be gentle and do not insert the toothpick more than one-eight inch or so or you could damage the fry and/or female.
6. Hold her under water and move her back and forth in the direction of here body and she should spit out the eggs.
7. Put the female into a recovery tank or back into the main tank if there is enough cover for her.
8. Use the Turkey baster to move the stripped eggs into your grow out tank.

Note:

If the eggs are not developed, you will need to bubble them in a egg tumbler. If they are heads and tails, I usually just drop them into a tank with a seasoned sponge filter and use the turkey baster to move them a bit two or three times a day until they are free-swimming.



good luck...

fOx

[merlyn2221]

Awesome info Fox. Wish I had it before my female Red Zebra died holding.
:bawl:
But I was a new fish "grandma" then, and didn't know any better. You should put this info on a sticky in some part of the site. It is well worth it for everyone who might need it, to see.

[Dave Schulman]

Thanx for ur advice fox!!! it worked great. Now one more question WHAT THE HELL DO I FEED NEW BORN FRY????????? And anything else i should know about keeping them alive PLEASE HELP!!!

[darthvader4bwu]

8) You can feed new born fry crushed flake food (some of which you feed your adults) and they should be fine.

[Dave Schulman]

I let them out about 20 minutes ago ... should i feed them tonite or wait till tomorrow. There are 15 in a small brine shrimp net till i find some where better, is this ok? the water is at 80F ... is this ok?
tahnx for all ur help guys!!!

[fOx]

They should be fine in the net for now, but you need to get a divider or another tank to keep them in if you want them to survive. Feeding them today should be fine, just adjust the poportions accordingly and make sure the flakes are really crushed up nicely...

good luck

fOx

[stefanos.f]

Me and my friend Nathan have 4 groups of Lab.caeruleus in 4 different tanks! We are keeping and breeding Lab.caeruleus for over 4 years now and know one thing for sure! Babies that come from a striped mother will spit or swallow their eggs when its going to be their turn to hold! WE HAVE NEVER STRIPED FEMALES THAT WERE HOLDING EGGS IN THEIR MOUTH AND WE NEVER HAD PROBLEMS! We have more than 45 tanks and are keeping more than 40 different species from lakes Tanganyika, Malawi and Victoria and have breeded most of them so far! All these years we found out that female African Cichlids learn, brood after brood, how to become good mothers and trust me its worth waiting! What we do is to remove the holding female from the main tank after 10 days and put her in a small 13gal tank (50lit.) untill she spits the babies, wich takes another 14-18 days! We keep the mother with the babies for another 10 days and feed her 4-5 times a day so that she gets back strong when we introduce her back to the main tank! We have now Lab.caruleus that give us more than 40 babies per spawn! The number 1 site on the web focusing exclusively on African Cichlids gives U alot of reasons why U should NEVER STRIP YOUR FEMALES! www.malawicichlidhomepage.com Just try to imagine how your fish feels about it!

P.S Most people who have problems breeding a African Cichlid species find out later that their females come from a striped mother! Ooops and thats why no one buys babies if he knows that their mom got striped!
P.S 2 Sorry about my bad english I m tryin as hard as I can!

[fOx]

The only problem with Stefanos comments is, how do I know if the electric yellow that I bought from the LFS was stripped when she was a baby or not? At least here in Canada, I have never been asked by the LFS owners whether the babies I was selling were stripped or not.

I find Stefano to be very admirable and well-meaning in his comments, but I have seen a few yellows (and others) die from emaciation (hunger) and I think in most circumstances that stripping a reluctant female will do far more good than harm.

just my 0.02 cents...

P.S> I have never heard of this problem which you refer to Stefanos... is there somewhere I can read up on it?

fOx

[stefanos.f]

Have a look here www.malawicichlidhomepage.com/aquainfo/famous_dont1.html As u will see, there are so many females who have to be striped today just because they didnt were released naturaly ether! Please stop striping your females! I never used these method! Yes I lost some broods but I was patient and the females who use to swallow learnd how and when to release the fry!

[Overawed]

Instead of stripping the females I put them into a breeder's net and they expel the fry naturally and with little stress.

[Dave Schulman]

This was her second brood. She ate the first one after letting her try it natural. Maybe next time ill try again naturally even though Ive never heard of ur problem Stefanos. She has 2 or 3 more in her mouth ... Ill leave them be. For now its 16 healthy fry and counting!
"tHe AnGrYfIsH"

[stefanos.f]

My friend Overawed BRAVO for doing it the right way! Mr Dave Schulman please just try to be a litle more patient (give the fish more than 3-4 chanches) and u will see it was worth all the waiting! I give U my WORD!

[Overawed]

Thanks Stefnaos, the other cool thing about putting them into breeders nets is that you get to watch the female blow the fry out and back in. Its very strange looking for lack of a better word. My Red Eureka female actually turned white and her lips turned black as she did this excersise. I wish I had a decent digital camera to capture the moment.

[fOx]

Here is some interesting reading to counter Stefano's argument...


http://www.cichlidae.com/articles/a151.html
(most interesting quote: "many experienced breeders have observed that stripping has no bearing on whether or not female's hold. After working with several successive generations, they have found that stripping doesn't seem to affect their ability to hold at all. It appears that holding is an instinct that is imprinted in the fry and has nothing to do with learning it's from a parent(s).")

fOx